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open letter to Autodesk. [message #168995] Thu, 26 January 2017 04:20 Go to next message
Luis Cupido
Messages: 2
Registered: January 2017
Junior Member
Dear Autodesk,

We are small company that have a license for EAGLE v7 and we
are quite happy using it.
It is excellent news that you have released version 8 and we
are excited with the prospects of innovations you may be delivering
for version 9, 10 ,11 etc in a future to come.

We understand that EAGLE now is available on subscription only,
that is fine with us. The only problem we see is that the fee value
for premium ver. 70euro/month seems quite wrong for our small company
business model.

We would like to see a monthly fee of 780 euro for using Eagle.
That really is much more realistic.

Our proposed terms are negotiable and we may drop amount that Autodesk
needs to pay us for the usage of Eagle quite a bit depending on some
licensing improvements Autodesk may do.

--

It is our understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) that Eagle projects
can only be opened in Eagle. Also Eagle only saves CAD files in Eagle
format.
So it is our understanding that we cannot use other software tools
to continue a work started in Eagle nor we can use anything else to view
Eagle files.
Therefore Autodesk will have the power to affect, impact or even disrupt our
work-flow and our design efforts (that cost us money).
Note this situation is totally different from MS-office or
Photoshop-Adobe or
even Autocad where files that can be worked out (almost) flawlessly in many
other software packages.

Our HDRM (hypothetical daily risk manager) (me) did a brief analysis of
our present
and past projects and calculated a monthly fee of about 850euro to cover
the risks
associated with granting a third party company the power to interfere
with our business.

We concluded that it does not matter if we are going to use Eagle a
little or a lot
or even if we did not used it at all for a period. As long as we want to
have the availability
to use it immediately (with or without Internet) when we so desire we
must keep paying a monthly or yearly subscription fee. to have the power
to use it.
Okay... sounds fair.

In the same way, it does not matter if Autodesk will use or not his power to
stop us from working on a project (either in the form of unintentional
unavailability
of license servers, or eventual loose of interest in Eagle and drop it,
or simply going out of business one day) as long as Autodest wants to
have that
disruptive interfering power in our small company should also be paying
us the
corresponding risk fee. If the previous sounds fair this one must sound
equally fair.

So the math is simple: 850(our risk)-70(eagle subs) = 780euro/month we are
willing to receive from Autodesk to start using Eagle 8 and newer.
We can depart from here as our position is fully negotiable :-)

We see quite ugly (to say the least) renting something that force us
to keep renting or otherwise face a retroactive loss.
Again I stress it is not fair since you don't view and edit Eagle files
elsewhere but in eagle.
Also not pretty to deny the common practice in long term projects
to backup all development environment and be able to recreate it later.

There is always a possibility to annoy all users by adding a powerful
"save-as/export" to solve this specific unfairness of your renting model
and stick to it...

I still see some other interesting options for Autodesk like adding the good
old perpetual license model, or simply take a seat and watch us all
move elsewhere.


Yours faithfully.

Luis C.
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169000 is a reply to message #168995] Thu, 26 January 2017 08:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Clem Martins
Messages: 251
Registered: December 2014
Senior Member
I see a storm brewing here and elsewhereX-(

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169001 is a reply to message #168995] Thu, 26 January 2017 10:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Markus Rudolf
Messages: 181
Registered: September 2008
Senior Member
Very well said. Thumbs up!

Markus
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169003 is a reply to message #168995] Thu, 26 January 2017 15:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ed Robledo
Messages: 49
Registered: August 2005
Member
Hi Luis,
Greatly appreciate reaching out to us on this Forum, I will do my best to take care as accurately as possible your questions.
First, lets be clear, EAGLE design files are stored locally on your computer, EAGLE neither Autodesk have no access to this or stored them in some cryptic cloud. The only thing Autodesk EAGLE needs to access is your license which its validation which is on the cloud, everything else remains locally on your computer. 
EAGLE files are stored in ASCII XML data structure, we also provide users with the .dtd documentation if you wish to understand how the file is structured. You can find the .dtd file in the EAGLE document folder.

If for some reason you needed to go offline, EAGLE will remain fully operational for 14 days, before that you need to get online and allow to validate the license entitlement.
If your subscription was to expire, EAGLE will remain working free mode, which allows you to open your designs you can also print, and export from it, including but not limited to, Gerber and Drill files for designs that exceed the free version limitation.

The Autdoesk EAGLE development team are diligently and consistently working on adding many new features which will enhance your design experience.
Why would Autodesk ever pull the servers or go out of business with EAGLE?  Autodesk is a well established company that intentionally would not jeopardize their hard earned reputation.  You can be assured if this was to ever happen, some sort of solution will be provided. 

Best Regards,
Ed

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169004 is a reply to message #169000] Thu, 26 January 2017 19:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Enrico Miglino
Messages: 20
Registered: May 2015
Junior Member
Nice way to say the reality. Agree. Not only respect this specific case.

Enrico

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169014 is a reply to message #169003] Fri, 27 January 2017 00:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Luis Cupido
Messages: 2
Registered: January 2017
Junior Member
Hi Ed,

Thanks for coming back to my rumbling.

> First, lets be clear, EAGLE design files are stored locally on your computer, EAGLE neither Autodesk
> have no access to this or stored them in some cryptic cloud. The only
thing Autodesk EAGLE needs
> to access is your license which its validation which is on the cloud,
everything else remains locally on your computer.

That was perfectly clear... I had no intention to suggest otherwise
neither any of my comments presumed otherwise.

> EAGLE files are stored in ASCII XML data structure, we also provide users with the .dtd documentation
>if you wish to understand how the file is structured. You can find the
..dtd file in the EAGLE document folder.

Indeed the guts of the file format is not really interesting for me to
understand, sorry. Same applies to the .dwg files of autocad I have no
interest also however they flawlessly work in nano-CAD, Draftsight,
Rhinoceros etc.

So please let me know a list of software packages where I can I can
continue a design that I started in Eagle. Thanks. (maybe they exist...
I don't know)

If we have the freedom of renting, stop and continue in another
software, then rental is fair.
If we rent, start a project and then are forced to keep renting to the
same company in order to finish the project, sorry but that is not fair.
(In this part of the world mortgages/loans can be moved from one bank to
another, if they could not be moved would empower a bank to rise the
values and squeeze a poor man to the last cent). I don't know how to
explain my point any better than this sorry, and this is my main
objection to this compulsory subscription
scheme.

> If for some reason you needed to go offline, EAGLE will remain fully operational for 14 days,
> before that you need to get online and allow to validate the license
entitlement.
> If your subscription was to expire, EAGLE will remain working free mode, which allows you
> to open your designs you can also print, and export from it,
including but not limited to,
> Gerber and Drill files for designs that exceed the free version
limitation.

That is clear, and all fine. Sounds right and according to the model you
want for Eagle.
Don't see any problem here. I've read that before... all fine.
The explanations you kindly gave here in this post and in earlier posts,
we all appreciate, denote the difficulty you are having to understand
the real issues that people are complaining about.
There is an underlying problem you should take an effort to grasp, which
is the modus-operandi of Eagle users. You may consider to resist the
temptation of trying to educate
everybody as it never worked out in the past.

> The Autdoesk EAGLE development team are diligently and consistently working on adding
> many new features which will enhance your design experience.

We would be happier if you add something that we want, the goal of any
company
is to please the customers... at least for my small one is.

> Why would Autodesk ever pull the servers or go out of business with EAGLE?
I can't really tell, as we are out of crystal balls for the moment, but
I'm sure you could come up with some ideas if I give you 6 months. About
the same time span from "Eagle will not go subscription " until today
;-) One idea that comes to mind is that one day it may become
financially uninteresting... who knows !

> Autodesk is a well established company that intentionally would not
> jeopardize their hard earned reputation.

I fully agree with the term "intentionally"
.... these Eagle licensing issues are certainly not improving your
reputation as I see it.

It is clear that the decision was taken and Autodesk is going to stick to it
so all I can say is that we will keep using ver 7.7 and will move to
KiCad (or else) on
the next big project that justifies the effort of moving.

Thanks for your time.

Luis C.
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169022 is a reply to message #169014] Fri, 27 January 2017 07:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Enrico Miglino
Messages: 20
Registered: May 2015
Junior Member
> If we rent, start a project and then are forced to keep renting to the
> same company in order to finish the project, sorry but that is not fair.
> (In this part of the world mortgages/loans can be moved from one bank to
> another, if they could not be moved would empower a bank to rise the
> values and squeeze a poor man to the last cent). I don't know how to
> explain my point any better than this sorry, and this is my main
> objection to this compulsory subscription
> scheme.
I sadly agree.
In 2015 I got a 1 year free license from Element14 as part of the PiIoT Challenge kit, so I unexpectedly experienced the period renting product. During this licensing period I moved from version 6.x to 7 and all was fine. Then I decided to buy a 7 unlimited license but almost in the same period I starting reading the news about the Eagle products acquired by Autodesk so I wait. At the actual date, unfortunately I have stopped this move, jut for the cost respect the projects (some also commercial ones) I am working on.

> Indeed the guts of the file format is not really interesting for me to
> understand, sorry. Same applies to the .dwg files of autocad I have no
> interest also however they flawlessly work in nano-CAD, Draftsight,
> Rhinoceros etc.

The way to port is something I am thinking too, as you can imagine. At the moment the only possible solution I see is through the Gerber export process, a format that can be imported in some other electronic CAD products.

> It is clear that the decision was taken and Autodesk is going to stick to it
> so all I can say is that we will keep using ver 7.7 and will move to
> KiCad (or else) on
> the next big project that justifies the effort of moving.

I have tried to understand what can be the reason of this apparently illogic move.
The only reason I can see is that after Autodesk put his hands on the Eagle package has already internally decided that the small and personal users are no longer interesting for the business model of the company. As a matter of fact the Autodesk business model applied to Eagle is something starting a process of +natural selection+, orienting the product to their core business without the need to explicitly declare this traumatic (for small users and small companies) decision as well sounds acceptable and reasonable for big customers.

Enrico

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169023 is a reply to message #169014] Fri, 27 January 2017 07:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rob Pearce
Messages: 481
Registered: September 2012
Senior Member
On 27/01/17 00:21, Luis Cupido wrote:
>
> the goal of any company
> is to please the customers...

Ah, if only.

Small companies appreciate that their customers are their lifeblood and
only by pleasing them can the company survive. Big companies with
presence on the stock markets owe that loyalty to the shareholders, who
frankly don't give a damn about mere customers.

Cadsoft were a small company. Autodesk aren't.
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169024 is a reply to message #169022] Fri, 27 January 2017 07:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tilmann Reh
Messages: 2068
Registered: October 2004
Senior Member
Enrico Miglino schrieb:

> The way to port is something I am thinking too, as you can imagine.
> At the moment the only possible solution I see is through the Gerber
> export process, a format that can be imported in some other
> electronic CAD products.
Apparently someone provided a way to port EAGLE designs to KiCad:
<http://hackaday.com/2015/12/27/eagle-to-kicad-made-easy/>

Tilmann
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169025 is a reply to message #169024] Fri, 27 January 2017 08:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Enrico Miglino
Messages: 20
Registered: May 2015
Junior Member
Hi Tilmann,
good suggestion, I was searching but I have not yet found this. I was thinking to something wider than kikad but reading the article it is anyway a good starting point.

Enrico

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169027 is a reply to message #169023] Fri, 27 January 2017 10:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joop_
Messages: 69
Registered: March 2007
Member
Rob Pearce wrote on Fri, 27 January 2017 08:36
On 27/01/17 00:21, Luis Cupido wrote:
>
> the goal of any company
> is to please the customers...

Ah, if only.

Small companies appreciate that their customers are their lifeblood and
only by pleasing them can the company survive. Big companies with
presence on the stock markets owe that loyalty to the shareholders, who
frankly don't give a damn about mere customers.

Cadsoft were a small company. Autodesk aren't.


Unfortunately, this is so true...

Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169063 is a reply to message #168995] Sat, 28 January 2017 14:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joop_
Messages: 69
Registered: March 2007
Member
I just stumbled over this: https://www.glassdoor.co.uk/Reviews/CADsoft-Reviews-E722114.htm

Doesn't look very well...Sad
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169065 is a reply to message #169063] Sat, 28 January 2017 15:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Clem Martins
Messages: 251
Registered: December 2014
Senior Member
Ouch! What can anyone say?

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Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169066 is a reply to message #169065] Sat, 28 January 2017 15:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Klaus Schmidinger
Messages: 1460
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
On 28.01.2017 16:45, C-3PO (Clem) wrote:
> Ouch! What can anyone say?

You do realize that this refers to a completely different company!?

--> www.cadsoft-consult.com

Klaus
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169067 is a reply to message #169066] Sat, 28 January 2017 16:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
rachaelp
Messages: 595
Registered: March 2015
Location: UK
Senior Member
Well spotted! This page is being linked to on other forums too and nobody else has pointed this out yet :D

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Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169068 is a reply to message #169066] Sat, 28 January 2017 16:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joop_
Messages: 69
Registered: March 2007
Member
Klaus Schmidinger wrote on Sat, 28 January 2017 16:57

You do realize that this refers to a completely different company!?

--> www.cadsoft-consult.com


Oops... you are right. I apologize.

Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169070 is a reply to message #169066] Sat, 28 January 2017 16:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joern Paschedag
Messages: 1451
Registered: August 2008
Senior Member
Am 28.01.2017 um 16:57 schrieb Klaus Schmidinger:
> On 28.01.2017 16:45, C-3PO (Clem) wrote:
>> Ouch! What can anyone say?
>
> You do realize that this refers to a completely different company!?
>
> --> www.cadsoft-consult.com
>
> Klaus

Hi Klaus,
apart from all this trouble it is nice to her a (verrry short) word from
you and I hope you are doing well ;-)

--
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169071 is a reply to message #169066] Sat, 28 January 2017 16:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Joern Paschedag
Messages: 1451
Registered: August 2008
Senior Member
Am 28.01.2017 um 16:57 schrieb Klaus Schmidinger:
> On 28.01.2017 16:45, C-3PO (Clem) wrote:
>> Ouch! What can anyone say?
>
> You do realize that this refers to a completely different company!?
>
> --> www.cadsoft-consult.com
>
> Klaus

Hi Klaus,
apart from all this trouble it is nice to hear a (verrry short) word
from you and I hope you are doing well ;-)

--
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / With best regards

Joern Paschedag
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169072 is a reply to message #169070] Sat, 28 January 2017 16:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tilmann Reh
Messages: 2068
Registered: October 2004
Senior Member
Joern Paschedag schrieb:

> Hi Klaus,
> apart from all this trouble it is nice to hear a (very short) word from
> you and I hope you are doing well ;-)

That's exactly what I was about to write. :-)

Tilmann
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169076 is a reply to message #168995] Sun, 29 January 2017 02:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Douglas Wong
Messages: 59
Registered: October 2013
Member
I bought Eagle about 14 years ago and have upgraded a couple of times, mostly to maintain file and library compatibility. However I don't think of it as upgrading. For me it was just buying a new product - which required a (hopefully reduced) learning curve and is not all that compatible with the old product. I still run 2 products or "versions" to support legacy designs.
I also won a license for V7 but never got it going due to the fluctuating licensing policies at that time. I have used Eagle to design many hundreds of schematics and PCBs. I have used at least 6 CAD packages and settled on Eagle primarily due to the cost structure. I have been waiting for the dust to settle before "upgrading" again, but the way it looks now I won't make a big switch. If I am ever forced to rent the new package because I want to use a design done with it, I will only use it when absolutely necessary. I expect to use the unlimited version I use now whenever possible.

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169078 is a reply to message #169076] Sun, 29 January 2017 07:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Enrico Miglino
Messages: 20
Registered: May 2015
Junior Member
Douglas,
I also won a license for V7 but never got it going due to the fluctuating licensing policies at that time.

Implicit in my previous posts this is an assertion I agree with. As a matter of fact, it is almost easy to understand. We can see that her almost all of the posts are from makers, professionals and free lancers; I mean that in a so large community like Element14 the only really interested to the disadvantages of this change of direction are from those "population" of users that probably the new big player and Eagle owner is no longer interested to. So, nothing strange that we are here discussing the question while this market change is approached by larger companies using Eagle as just a change in their automated payment mechanism to this customer. And this is just what Autodesk probably wants. This is just my impression and I like (we all like I suppose) to hear some information about this position from the direct voice of Autodesk that surely is reading these posts. Then, despite what answer we can receive - if any - my skepticism remain for the next months until I see what re the really maintained promises and what are not.

Enrico

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169080 is a reply to message #169078] Sun, 29 January 2017 09:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Douglas Wong
Messages: 59
Registered: October 2013
Member
I'm certain Autodesk is interested in the existing user base, but every software supplier struggles with how to generate a continuous revenue stream from their products. There are all sorts of business models and Autodesk has lots of experience with this and I'm sure has evaluated many of them to arrive at this licensing scheme.
Most CAD companies have adopted a heavy initial price plus a hefty annual maintenance fee as their model. Traditionally Eagle was lower cost to buy and lower cost to upgrade. This new "pay-per-view" scheme from Autodesk is different, but for me it is a deterrent to using it. This is radically different from the old Eagle scheme where the more you use the product the less it costs per use.

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169081 is a reply to message #169080] Sun, 29 January 2017 09:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Enrico Miglino
Messages: 20
Registered: May 2015
Junior Member
> Traditionally Eagle was lower cost to buy and lower cost to upgrade.

This is the point. It seems that we should start forgetting Eagle as this kind of product family; with a move done in a fake-soft way :D

Enrico

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Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169102 is a reply to message #168995] Sun, 29 January 2017 21:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alberto Vignati
Messages: 20
Registered: December 2010
Junior Member
Hi Luis,

there are also a couple of thing that should taken in account:
1) Eagle is not a new product, it comes from a long term history. It is
not a new choice that one can evaluate, so the license change has an
heavy impact: I think that many people, like me, spent a lot of time
writing their own ULPs, building libraries, making designs and so on.
2) Autodesk, since it has bought Cadsoft, is fully legimated to change
the license terms. Ok, it is legal, but at the same time, for the
previous reason, it is absolutely unfair.
One of the reason of which, many years ago, I chose Eagle was the old
licence model: I avoid subscription models for stategic tools yesterday,
today and tomorrow (I explained why in another post) and this change
makes very very very angry (in my native language "incazzato nero").
This is what I will do: with this license model I will never migrate to
the V8, for the moment I stay on the old version but I start to evaluate
alternatives. It is clear and simple.
The question is: how many people think like me? Few? A lot? There are
few months to count them: in this year I think most of them will switch
to an alternative.

Kinds regards

Alberto

Il 26/01/2017 05:20, Luis Cupido ha scritto:
> Dear Autodesk,
>
> We are small company that have a license for EAGLE v7 and we
> are quite happy using it.
> It is excellent news that you have released version 8 and we
> are excited with the prospects of innovations you may be delivering
> for version 9, 10 ,11 etc in a future to come.
>
> We understand that EAGLE now is available on subscription only,
> that is fine with us. The only problem we see is that the fee value
> for premium ver. 70euro/month seems quite wrong for our small company
> business model.
>
> We would like to see a monthly fee of 780 euro for using Eagle.
> That really is much more realistic.
>
> Our proposed terms are negotiable and we may drop amount that Autodesk
> needs to pay us for the usage of Eagle quite a bit depending on some
> licensing improvements Autodesk may do.
>
> --
>
> It is our understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) that Eagle projects
> can only be opened in Eagle. Also Eagle only saves CAD files in Eagle
> format.
> So it is our understanding that we cannot use other software tools
> to continue a work started in Eagle nor we can use anything else to view
> Eagle files.
> Therefore Autodesk will have the power to affect, impact or even disrupt
> our
> work-flow and our design efforts (that cost us money).
> Note this situation is totally different from MS-office or
> Photoshop-Adobe or
> even Autocad where files that can be worked out (almost) flawlessly in many
> other software packages.
>
> Our HDRM (hypothetical daily risk manager) (me) did a brief analysis of
> our present
> and past projects and calculated a monthly fee of about 850euro to cover
> the risks
> associated with granting a third party company the power to interfere
> with our business.
>
> We concluded that it does not matter if we are going to use Eagle a
> little or a lot
> or even if we did not used it at all for a period. As long as we want to
> have the availability
> to use it immediately (with or without Internet) when we so desire we
> must keep paying a monthly or yearly subscription fee. to have the power
> to use it.
> Okay... sounds fair.
>
> In the same way, it does not matter if Autodesk will use or not his
> power to
> stop us from working on a project (either in the form of unintentional
> unavailability
> of license servers, or eventual loose of interest in Eagle and drop it,
> or simply going out of business one day) as long as Autodest wants to
> have that
> disruptive interfering power in our small company should also be paying
> us the
> corresponding risk fee. If the previous sounds fair this one must sound
> equally fair.
>
> So the math is simple: 850(our risk)-70(eagle subs) = 780euro/month we are
> willing to receive from Autodesk to start using Eagle 8 and newer.
> We can depart from here as our position is fully negotiable :-)
>
> We see quite ugly (to say the least) renting something that force us
> to keep renting or otherwise face a retroactive loss.
> Again I stress it is not fair since you don't view and edit Eagle files
> elsewhere but in eagle.
> Also not pretty to deny the common practice in long term projects
> to backup all development environment and be able to recreate it later.
>
> There is always a possibility to annoy all users by adding a powerful
> "save-as/export" to solve this specific unfairness of your renting model
> and stick to it...
>
> I still see some other interesting options for Autodesk like adding the
> good
> old perpetual license model, or simply take a seat and watch us all
> move elsewhere.
>
>
> Yours faithfully.
>
> Luis C.
Re: open letter to Autodesk. [message #169103 is a reply to message #169102] Sun, 29 January 2017 22:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Markus Rudolf
Messages: 181
Registered: September 2008
Senior Member
On 29.01.2017 22:21, Alberto Vignati wrote:
> The question is: how many people think like me? Few? A lot? There are
> few months to count them: in this year I think most of them will switch
> to an alternative.

I'm afraid they will learn the hard way that it is the majority.

I'm just sorry for the old CadSoft team. It must be hard to see 25+
years going south just because of shareholder value.

Markus
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169166 is a reply to message #169072] Wed, 01 February 2017 09:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Morten Leikvoll
Messages: 1348
Registered: November 2007
Senior Member
On 28.01.2017 17:50, Tilmann Reh wrote:
> Joern Paschedag schrieb:
>
>> Hi Klaus,
>> apart from all this trouble it is nice to hear a (very short) word from
>> you and I hope you are doing well ;-)
>
> That's exactly what I was about to write. :-)
>
> Tilmann
>
Ditto :)

Klaus should maybe write the story of Eagle from the early days upto
today ;)
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169169 is a reply to message #169072] Wed, 01 February 2017 13:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Andreas Fecht
Messages: 118
Registered: November 2004
Senior Member
Tilmann Reh schrieb:
> Joern Paschedag schrieb:
>
>> Hi Klaus,
>> apart from all this trouble it is nice to hear a (very short) word from
>> you and I hope you are doing well ;-)
>
> That's exactly what I was about to write. :-)
>
> Tilmann
>

ME2 :-)

Andreas
Re: open letter to Autod esk. [message #169172 is a reply to message #169066] Wed, 01 February 2017 17:49 Go to previous message
Jorge Garcia
Messages: 1294
Registered: April 2010
Senior Member
On 1/28/2017 10:57 AM, Klaus Schmidinger wrote:
> On 28.01.2017 16:45, C-3PO (Clem) wrote:
>> Ouch! What can anyone say?
>
> You do realize that this refers to a completely different company!?
>
> --> www.cadsoft-consult.com
>
> Klaus

Hi Klaus!

It's nice to hear from you again. I hope everything in your life is
going well and the you are enjoying your new ventures.

If there's ever anything I can do for you.

Please let me know.

Best Regards,
Jorge Garcia
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