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Color schemes [message #159385] Wed, 21 January 2015 21:46 Go to next message
Moritz Augsburger
Messages: 7
Registered: November 2013
Junior Member
Hi,

I'm fiddling around quite a while with the colors, but never get really
happy. So I wanted to ask you to provide screenshots of your customized
appereance and, if possible, even post the config.

Thanks
Moritz

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Re: Color schemes [message #159387 is a reply to message #159385] Wed, 21 January 2015 23:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
warrenbrayshaw
Messages: 1732
Registered: January 2010
Location: New Zealand
Senior Member
Hi

Some people do change their colours but I recommend you limit what you do.

Remember that your settings are not recorded in the design so other people reviewing your design will see their colour settings. This one reason alone suggests you should only use the first eight colours and their highlighted versions (the next row of the palette).

The simplest change is to make a decision on whether to use Alpha blending or not. Turning it off suits many people.

I use the default colours (black palette) with one change. I have changed the highlighted colour, used for airwires from yellow to Magenta.

HTH
Warren

Re: Color schemes [message #159400 is a reply to message #159387] Fri, 23 January 2015 15:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Andreas Weidner
Messages: 564
Registered: November 2008
Senior Member
Am 22.01.2015 um 00:19 schrieb Warren Brayshaw:
> Remember that your settings are not recorded in the design so other people
> reviewing your design will see their colour settings.

I choose to disagree:
- Yes, other people might want to see my designs.
- BUT I route LOTS of hours in front of the screen, and they don't, so
I prefer to see some optimised colours for myself and,
- in case I want to sent the design to other people, just use
different colour settings then (e.g., the default).
- As a matter of fact, I don't even do that, because all other people
I send the designs to are using the same EAGLE installation, anyway,
because they find the default CadSoft colours suboptimal.

> This one reason alone
> suggests you should only use the first eight colours and their highlighted
> versions (the next row of the palette).

We are using much more colours than that, also making much more use of
transparency than usual, making it possible
- to decently see top AND bottom at the same time (and even up to two
inner layers)
- with a grid that isn't too prominent, etc.
Attached are two (VERY small) screen shots, the black one rather
old-fashioned (but with more transparency to not let the top nearly hide
the bottom), the white one QUITE unusual, but good even for an office
with LOTS of light. Most of the guys in our institute use the white
colour scheme, because they can see everything on screen properly, even
in high summer.

If you're interested, I can send some bigger screenshots or the
corresponding ULPs to your e-mail address (I don't do this here due to
size restrictions).

Andreas Weidner
  • Attachment: black.png
    (Size: 7.26KB, Downloaded 7469 times)
  • Attachment: white.png
    (Size: 7.37KB, Downloaded 7415 times)
Re: Color schemes [message #159401 is a reply to message #159400] Fri, 23 January 2015 20:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jorge Garcia
Messages: 1282
Registered: April 2010
Senior Member
Hi Andreas,

This is really cool, could you forward the color scripts to
support@cadsoftusa.com? I'd like to check them out.

Thanks,
Jorge Garcia
Re: Color schemes [message #159476 is a reply to message #159401] Fri, 30 January 2015 21:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Moritz Augsburger
Messages: 7
Registered: November 2013
Junior Member
> CadSoft Guest wrote:
>
>
>
> Remember that your settings are not recorded in the design so other
> people
>
> reviewing your design will see their colour settings. This one reason
> alone
>
> suggests you should only use the first eight colours and their
> highlighted
>
> versions (the next row of the palette).
I know, but that's no problem, as I normally automatically create images
of top and bottom layer (https://github.com/maugsburger/evie), and so
far no one ever directly edited the files, at least I didn't see any
forks with checkins on github.

> Andreas Weidner wrote:
>
>
>
> If you're interested, I can send some bigger screenshots or the
>
> corresponding ULPs to your e-mail address (I don't do this here due
> to
>
> size restrictions).
They look very nice, please send the files to moritz(dot)augsburger

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Re: Color schemes [message #163165 is a reply to message #159400] Fri, 04 September 2015 06:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Stephan Lehmann
Messages: 1
Registered: September 2015
Junior Member
Please send me the files to technik(at)stephanlehmann.net.

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Re: Color schemes [message #163223 is a reply to message #159400] Tue, 08 September 2015 12:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Benoit Rapidel
Messages: 2
Registered: September 2015
Junior Member
Hi,
Can you send ULP script to willykaze(at)willykaze.org ?

Cheers.

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Re: Color schemes [message #164447 is a reply to message #159400] Mon, 14 December 2015 01:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
plocher
Messages: 9
Registered: January 2014
Junior Member
I followed up on the comments here and pulled together a couple of
EagleCAD scripts and menus to make playing with colors easier.

SPCoast.scr
( http://www.spcoast.com/pub/download/docs/Documents-PCB-Design-howto-SPCoast .scr)
is my high level customizations script for various dimensions, menus and
the like, with the operative bit being:

{code:jivemacro_uid=_14500484828756618|class=jive_text_macro
jive_macro_code _jivemacro_uid_14500484828756618}
MENU 'Settings { SPCoast Colors : script SPCoastcolors.scr; \

               | Eagle Colors : script defaultcolors.scr; \

               | Layers : script SPCoastlayers.scr; \

               | reload SPCoast : script SPCoast.scr; \

               | Black : set palette Black; window; \

               | White : set palette White; window; \

               | Colored : set palette Colored; window; }';

{code}

This makes it easy to load updated/different color palettes and/or
layer-color mappings and change the palette being used.  Since I mainly
play with colors in the board editor, I put this menu in the BRD
section; it would work globally as well.

The second script is one to set the layer-color mappings,
SPCoastlayers.scr
( http://www.spcoast.com/pub/download/docs/Documents-PCB-Design-howto-SPCoast layers.scr). 
These mappings are in each lbr, sch and brd file, and follow your
project or library around as you share it with others.  This means that
you can have projects that map layers to different colors, even though
they all are using the same global palette.

{code:jivemacro_uid=_14500493649717269|class=jive_text_macro
jive_macro_code _jivemacro_uid_14500493649717269}
set COLOR_LAYER  1 4;

set COLOR_LAYER 16 2;

set COLOR_LAYER 17 23;

set COLOR_LAYER 18 29;

set COLOR_LAYER 19 6;

... etc ...

{code}

If you get a board design from someone else (that has odd colors...),
simply run this layers script to reset them to your preferences.

The various levels of color choice indirection in EagleCAD make it hard
to follow the connections between a color palette, the layers file, and
the actual color being used; it gets worse when several layers all use
the same color and you can't tell them apart.
I keep thinking it might be simpler to simply assign each layer to a
different color pair (color and color+8, due to the alpha channel stuff)
- but I'm not there yet.

The important point with the colors script is to group like things
together, so that the color you choose for one works well for the
others.  An example is the top copper layer, the top keepout and top
restrict layers, which all work well when they share the same base color
with different fill patterns.
This takes us to the 3rd script - SPCoastcolors.scr
( http://www.spcoast.com/pub/download/docs/Documents-PCB-Design-howto-SPCoast colors.scr)
- which is where colors are defined.  It has its roots in the CadSoft
defaultcolors.scr script, but has been extended to cover all 3 palettes
with "my" set of favorite colors.

This script sets individual palette colors (which end up in
$HOME/.eaglerc) for your whole Eagle installation.  Any project you open
in EagleCAD on your computer will use the color palettes defined there.

I added - as comments - the layers that went with each palette location,
so that I could remember which color showed up where.  This helps
considerably when customizing things:

{code:jivemacro_uid=_14500496266321110|class=jive_text_macro
_jivemacro_uid_14500496266321110 jive_macro_code}
set palette White;

set palette 1 0xB43232C8;

# Bottom, vRestrict

set palette 2 0xB419960E;

# bKeepout, bRestrict

set palette 3 0xD3FC9C38;

# Top, tKeepout, tRestrict

set palette 4 0xB4BF1421;

set palette 5 0xB4C832C8;

# Unrouted set palette 6 0xB4C8C832;

# bValues

# generic grey, bDocu

set palette 7 0xB4C8C8C8;

{code}

If you want to use all 3 palettes (black, white and colored), remember
that they all use the same layer-to-color mapping, and the alpha
blending makes for wildly different color saturations between black,
white and beige backgrounds...
For Alpha channel values, I tend use hex(B4) for the odd rows (first,
third, ... ) and something larger for the even rows - unless I simply
use a more saturated color instead.  Using FF for the alpha of a color
means you can't see anything "behind" it, which is annoying.

I got frustrated by not being able to see/use hex values in the Eagle
Settings/color picker (and being forced to use hex values in the
script); I found it slightly easier to use a 3rd party color picker tool
when customizing colors.
Unfortunately, it seems that "nobody else in the known world" has a
color picker that puts hex color values with an alpha channel at the
beginning, so you can't simply copy/paste from color picker tools into
your script without some fiddling.
Worse, none seem to have the ability to set the background for showing
the alpha blend, so you can't easily visualize the result (new color
alpha blended on black, on white and on colored...) outside of Eagle...

This leads to a managable, but click-intensive workflow cycle as you
tune your colors:
start up a text editor on the colors.scr file (once)
menu -> load the layer mapping by running the layers script (once)
repeat:

menu -> load the new colors by running the colors.scr script
pick a layer to tweak, decide if you are happy with it.
if not, spin up a color picker and find a replacement color
copy/paste it into the SPCoastcolors.scr palette location, edit the
result to have the right alpha channel bits at the beginning.
save the colors  file

At some point I'll probably write a script  to extract the palette out
of an eaglerc file (and the layer info out of a brd file...) into SCRipt
files that can be used here; till then, Paul Badger has a good writeup
( https://moderndevice.com/uncategorized/creating-a-script-to-set-your-color- palettes-in-eagle/)
on extracting them by hand.

----
If CadSoft is listening, here's some concrete suggestions:
* colors and layer to color mappings should be in the same place. 
Having them split means you can't really share projects and expect them
to look the same.
* I'd prefer these settings to be in my $HOME/.eaglerc and not in the
sch and brd files, though I could see them optionally being put into the
project directory's eagle.epf
* Don't make it hard to keep many projects in sync color-wise by
hardcoding these settings in the wrong place!
* The color picker should allow / show hex and decimal values, and use
RGB, HSV, greyscale and CYMK sliders
* When selecting a particular color in a palette, show the layers that
use it
* Since the layers implicitly tie into all 3 palettes, it would be nice
to have a mechanism to see all 3 palettes at once, with the ability to
set the 3 color variations for the selected cell at the same time.
* Fix the whole alpha channel mess.  Don't tie them to colors in the
palette - define them dynamically as you need to highlight things, layer
things and hide things.  If anything, it should be LAYERS that have
alpha values, not colors...

Hope this helps someone else out there...

  -John

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Re: Color schemes [message #164448 is a reply to message #164447] Mon, 14 December 2015 08:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Benoit Rapidel
Messages: 2
Registered: September 2015
Junior Member
Thank you so much for your detail comments and your files…

This help a lot.

Benoit

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Re: Color schemes [message #164450 is a reply to message #164447] Mon, 14 December 2015 13:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Paul Badger
Messages: 65
Registered: March 2014
Member
> "   If CadSoft is listening, here's some concrete suggestions:
>
>
> * colors and layer to color mappings should be in the same place. 
> Having them split means you can't really share projects and expect
> them to look the same.
>
> * I'd prefer these settings to be in my $HOME/.eaglerc and not in the
> sch and brd files, though I could see them optionally being put into
> the project directory's eagle.epf
>
> * Don't make it hard to keep many projects in sync color-wise by
> hardcoding these settings in the wrong place!
>
> * The color picker should allow / show hex and decimal values, and use
> RGB, HSV, greyscale and CYMK sliders
>
> * When selecting a particular color in a palette, show the layers that
> use it
>
> * Since the layers implicitly tie into all 3 palettes, it would be
> nice to have a mechanism to see all 3 palettes at once, with the
> ability to set the 3 color variations for the selected cell at the
> same time.
>
> * Fix the whole alpha channel mess.  Don't tie them to colors in the
> palette - define them dynamically as you need to highlight things,
> layer things and hide things.  If anything, it should be LAYERS that
> have alpha values, not colors...   
>
>

If Cadsoft is listening ........      ( One always wonders as the
versions come and go and nothing in the interface changes. ) 

An example of excellent and fluid UI for color menu management is the
way color palettes are managed in Photoshop.
That kind of fluidity in UI is what you should be aiming for.

Keeping palettes in the scr and brd files has been requested from around
five years back.
Load and Save buttons for palettes have been suggested by myself and
(probably others). Hey - now the script is done - just put in a button
on palette page. (A la Photoshop)
Another suggestion is to be able to edit colors right from the layer
palette ( like you can from the Photoshop toolbox).
+1 to the idea of putting the alpha channel on the layers.
If it seems useful it is possible to have two alpha channels one in
colors and one in layers, just multiplying them.

Ending the "you can't get there from here" feeling in Eagle would go a
long way to making users feel like they're using modern software. Fixing
the UI "roadblocks" (aka "you have to do it the Eagle way") would also
let users leverage a bit of what they know about how other software
packages work.

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Re: Color schemes [message #164460 is a reply to message #164450] Wed, 16 December 2015 06:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Robert Johnson
Messages: 87
Registered: November 2004
Member
Paul Badger wrote:
>> ...[snip]...
>> * Fix the whole alpha channel mess. Don't tie them to colors in the
>> palette - define them dynamically as you need to highlight things,
>> layer things and hide things. If anything, it should be LAYERS that
>> have alpha values, not colors...
>>
>>
>
> If Cadsoft is listening ........ ( One always wonders as the
> versions come and go and nothing in the interface changes. )
>
> An example of excellent and fluid UI for color menu management is the
> way color palettes are managed in Photoshop.
> That kind of fluidity in UI is what you should be aiming for.
>
> Keeping palettes in the scr and brd files has been requested from around
> five years back.
> Load and Save buttons for palettes have been suggested by myself and
> (probably others). Hey - now the script is done - just put in a button
> on palette page. (A la Photoshop)
> Another suggestion is to be able to edit colors right from the layer
> palette ( like you can from the Photoshop toolbox).
> +1 to the idea of putting the alpha channel on the layers.
> If it seems useful it is possible to have two alpha channels one in
> colors and one in layers, just multiplying them.
>
> Ending the "you can't get there from here" feeling in Eagle would go a
> long way to making users feel like they're using modern software. Fixing
> the UI "roadblocks" (aka "you have to do it the Eagle way") would also
> let users leverage a bit of what they know about how other software
> packages work.
>
> --
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> http://www.element14.com/community/message/169437

Most of my graphics work on my Linux system is done with Blender--the same
program used by many movie studios. By comparison, the Eagle UI is
simplicity itself. Keep in mind that Eagle is multi-platform, and 'modern'
has a different feel for Mac, Linux, and Windows users.

I do agree with having alpha channels on layers though. I find the current
cross-hatched and dotted approach to coloring multi-layer boards hard to
follow on-screen. A toolbar / editor command for raising and lowering alpha
values by-layer would be nice.

Bob
Re: Color schemes [message #164490 is a reply to message #159400] Sun, 20 December 2015 10:37 Go to previous message
Thomas Hambck
Messages: 4
Registered: December 2015
Junior Member
Could send me larger images of your screenshots to fansoftware[at]web.de
?

I prefer dots as grid. It's more pleasent to see as gridlines.

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